Recently, decays (, ) were analyzed under the assumption of flavor SU(3) symmetry (SU(3)). Although the individual fits to or decays are good, it was found that the combined fit is very poor: there is a disagreement with the SU(3) limit of the standard model (SM). One can remove this discrepancy by adding SU(3)-breaking effects, but 1000% SU(3) breaking is required. In this paper, we extend this analysis to include decays in which there is an and/or meson in the final state. We now find that the combined fit exhibits a discrepancy with the SM, and 1000% SU(3)-breaking effects are still required to explain the data. These results are rigorous, group-theoretically – no theoretical assumptions have been made. But when one adds some theoretical input motivated by QCD factorization, the discrepancy with the SM grows to .

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